PEN15 could make history as Hulu’s first Emmy-nominated comedy series as the nomination season begins to heat up. Behind the show are not only on-camera stars Maya Erskine and Anna Konkle, but the third musketeer in an incredible creative trio: Sam Zvibleman, who co-created the show and also directed much of the series.
Zvibleman says his trajectory in becoming part of the group stemmed largely from moving to New York City and becoming friends with an intimate group of indie filmmakers.
"We met a couple of times and I came to a short film screening and Anna and Maya asked if I might want to collaborate and we came up with a show together," he said.
"We would meet a couple of times a week and brainstorm and we came up with an idea about kids breaking out of a cult, and we started talking about all these stories about when we were 13. And at a certain point, these stories of growing up and being around 13 are so interesting and fascinating and rich that we said, 'Forget the cult thing, and just do the truth of our lives.'"
However, Zvibleman says it wasn’t that easy getting the show to air. They had lots of passes before Hulu, and a lot of execs questioned if Erskine and Konkle, both 34, could truly portray 13-year-old girls. Despite the struggle to get the show on-air, Zvibleman said the initial writing as a trio was quite magical.
"It was a really great sort of mind meld. They were coming from a point of view of small moments and character moments. There’s no script that doesn’t have all three of us somewhere in it," he said.
"It was amazing to have an actor’s POV with the scripts. As just a writer, you might not be great in a pitch meeting but when you have actors in those meetings they are making people laugh and already performing stuff. So having the collaboration was just really great."
A favorite for an Emmy for Outstanding Directing For A Comedy Series, Zvibleman says the writers room just got stronger as the show went to series and the group was able to add more writers.
"We had no shortage of ideas, of inspiration. We were more able to connect and find moments we love and how they could pay off. One example was we really wanted to have Maya and her mom and the idea of Japanese baths and one of our writers went, 'Well, what if they are coming from a place of conflict while taking this bath.' All our writers' minds really helped connect these moments into the full story."
While Erskine and Konkle are both favorites for Outstanding Lead Actress noms, the show boasts a wealth of talented supporting actors.
The character Sam (Taj Cross) is based on Zvibleman himself, and Cross brings a boatload of empathy in his performance. Zvibleman was not afraid to mine upsetting middle school experiences as the writers worked on Sam’s arc.
"I thought I had a good middle school experience but looking back over it, I was just good at bouncing back from embarrassment and awkwardness and humiliation," he said.
"I thought everything was great, but I did have some traumas. I never felt or externalized like Anna and Maya did. But when Sam tries to get in with the popular kids, he had a moment — like Maya’s character. Maybe I could social climb and be cool, but realize I wasn't cut out for that world. I didn’t earn the seat; it just kind of happened to me. I had to retreat back to my core group, and that was a very humbling experience."
As the nominations approach and creators and fans have a chance to look back, Zvibleman recalls his favorite directing experiences with the show fondly.
"I’m really proud of the whole theatre story," he said.
For those not in the know, watching Maya perform as the star of an age-inappropriate play with warring factions between tech theatre kids and onstage theatre kids is pure strange joy.
"The extreme depth of that strange play, the play itself; the beautiful, strange, devastating dream ballet ... it was my attempt at a play behind a play. That was really more interesting to me than a-laugh-a-minute stuff," Zvibleman said, noting that he relates hard to the dynamic between Maya and Anna when Anna discovers she’s really good at her tech position.
"I was rejected from a school play. I was the only kid who didn’t get a part, and I had a lot of built-up resentment — the same dynamic as the crew and the actors in the show. I really understand the grips rolling their eyes at the actor who needs their perfect light, and the actor who is like, 'You can’t do anything without me!'"
Maya’s starring turn in the school play dovetails nicely into first-love feelings with the characters of Sam and Gabe (Dylan Gage). Both are scene-stealers and feel bound for big things.
Zvibleman spoke of discovering first-time actors in the youngsters.
"There's a lot of strength and weakness to hiring kids who are almost all non-actors. Some of them in season two had acted in season one, and they are even better in season two. There is so much authenticity in most kid actors ... we cast each of them because they had that gift of being grounded. They were all friends with each other behind the scenes, so that made it even more special."
Zvibleman might be biased since the character of Sam is based on him, but he had much praise for the character's young actor, Cross.
"The kid who played Sam is brilliant. He takes his work so seriously. And Dylan Gage, who plays Gabe, is a comedic genius. He was so fearless and brave and awesome for a kid to take on struggling with his sexuality, and he just did it brilliantly. Gabe taught us a lot this season,” Zvibleman said before pivoting to speak about his kinship and inspiration for Sam.
"I have no clue if other men are like me, where you can one minute be in a locker room with guys, and the next minute be so deeply torn and internally confused and yearning for a different kind of friendship," he said.
"I think girls are just better at externalizing emotions with each other. I mean, I’m still learning how to talk with my male friends today. I think there must be a lot of other Sams out there who haven’t learned how to talk about emotion in the same way, and girls are just naturally gifted at that.”
PEN15 has come a long way since its humble, web series roots but Zvibleman is convinced the web series approach is a good one.
"I believe it worked. I knew them and how talented they were, and I was convinced someone with money would see that it would work ... we sent it out to all the cable and streaming networks and Hulu said yes and everyone else said no or they thought it felt too much like a sketch. You just need that one 'yes.' That one was Hulu and specifically, Billy Rosenberg at Hulu," he said.
"We had a very small budget the first season because no one knew about it, but there also was not a lot of oversight and we got to be very free, creatively. I am sometimes still shocked to this day that people have seen it. For so long it was just me, Maya and Anna in the edit room and having no clue that anyone would find our show. I knew we brought it through blood, sweat and tears, but I still didn’t know if it would break through.”
Emmy predictors seem convinced it will absolutely break through — including at the big awards show — likely because of the unbreakable connection between Anna and Maya. Their friendship love story is undeniably the thread that keeps viewers coming back.
Zvibleman agrees.
"Anna and Maya’s friendship and their love was the story that actually felt complete after season one ... but with the questions, 'Can you survive middle school?' and, 'Can their friendship survive middle school?' there was more to explore," he said.
"When Maya becomes the star of the play this season and Anna becomes the techie, there is a big question of will they reunite to coexist in their different roles? And yes, we are always looking to test their friendship; will this love and romance survive all these tests? Will a guy take them away from each other? etc. Those love stories and friendship stories are a critical part of middle school. Everyone had an Anna or a Maya best friend, and that’s what people responded to."
Because of Anna and Maya’s closeness, the show is often a heartbreaker (even if unintentionally so).
"Will the next season break your heart? It’s never our intention. It’s simply our intention to be truthful," Zvibleman said.
"I kind of took each of the seasons as a different album; they have a very different vibe. I really approached them like a new album. The next batch will also feel that way, too. We hoped the show was ultimately for all ages around the world. That people could say, 'This was my middle school experience, too.'"
No matter where the show goes, Zvibleman promises to keep it in middle school.
"Middle school is life,” he said.
"There’s so much emotion, so many stories."
He’s convinced the show will never run out, and one glance back to middle school tells us he’s absolutely right.